I notice the "brave" people behind this site left out the sexual aspect of dreams deliberately.Why? Sex is one of the most important motivations in a person's life and you leave it out. I'll start then,ok? I had sex in a lucid dream.Several times.I can't really call it sex because I did not ejaculate,least not since a was young...a wet dream. How is this possible? I find myself lying with this woman on top of me,riding me. I see a double exposure of her and a normal looking woman.The real "her" is a lanky,skinny,skeleton like person.No hair. We even engage in a little conversation and she says she has been visiting me since I was a child.I make an amusing comment and she turns away and laughs.A satisfying experience. There has been mara type experiences as well,when fully awake.These are more frightening.

John, there are quite a few posts on LDs and sex if you sift through the various threads on this forum.

There is an interesting section in Stephen LaBerge's book that confirms that some men who had been asked to have sex in LDs, had intense orgasms but did not ejaculate. But I think there has been no substantial study on this.

Owen

PS did you see this site http://network54.com/Forum/20204

Thanks, Owen, for your response to John's comments. Indeed the topic of sex in lucid dreams has not been left out on this discussion site. Being a fairly popular pursuit, it has it's place amongst a variety of applications.

One can imagine how especially meaningful lucid dream sex would be for those who are unable to experience intimate sexual interactions, for whatever reason, in their waking lives. And on another level, it's interesting to consider the symbolism beneath the imagery of merging. Stephen Berlin posted a heartfelt experience that comes to mind in this regard (see Dreams of Transcendence) that illustrates the transcendent possibilities of this type of exploration.

And John, if you're interested, and as Owen's pointed out, the issue of mind/body effects is addressed in LaBerge's book "Exploring the World of Lucid Dreaming".

Sweet dreams to all, Keelin

At the suggestion of the the moderator I'm restarting the thread on sex in lucid dreams, having shifted from the 20th Anniversary thread.

There is one psychological aspect of my LD sex that I find personally disturbing, and that's my discovery of how much of a chauvanist pig I may really be at heart (or at mind). My dream partners are pretty much sex objects to me, for my personal pleasure. There's little if any spiritual communion going on here, nice as that sounds. Now, whether this is due to my being alone for the last three years, or a real character flaw I can't say, although I can say that my real relationships have been very deep in the past, much more than simple self-gratification.

A little waking guilt here over my lucid dream behavior. Can anyone relate?

Paul

Yes, Paul, I can relate. However, LD sex is one of my favorite LD pursuits. I've had polygamous encounters (myself and two Hawaiian men), and one lesbian encounter. I've enjoyed the most romantic of schoolgirl crush fantasies, complete with hearts and flowers, and wantonly lustful encounters. Considering my Christian lifestyle and belief system, this is hardly something I feel entirely comfy with. Still, when I'm lucid, it's hard not to enjoy the enormous freedom to fill in some emotional and/or physical gaps in my waking life. So yes, I can relate to some waking guilt over LD's. I guess it's a matter of choice. I keep saying I'll pursue something serious or spiritual, do something useful with lucidity, but I just can't resist the urge to have as much fun as I can cram into one REM period.

I'm going to go ahead and confess right here. The main motivation for me to become successful in lucid dreaming is the LD sex. Since being a nice quiet guy puts me into a huge social disadvantage, I had to find alternative ways to experience sexual intimacy since finding dates is not really an option for me. It has helped bring some balance in my personal life which otherwise would have left me too often frustrated and depressed.

One LD skill that I have been working on is inducing specific dream characters. I would say that this is more challenging then just inducing LDs almost every night. It has made me learn about the nature of dreams itself, what I can and can't do. For example, it's easy to make objects move buy just by thinking, or flying, or hooking up with a random girl. But to have a specific character show up in a dream is very hard. I found that dream characters in general are very tied in with dream flow. It's possible to alter the dream flow a bit, but making a big change the dream flow is very hard. Unfortunately, introducing a specific dream character requires a big change in the dream flow. It took me many LDs to figure out how to overcome that challenge. So far the effort has been paying off. For example, I had two intimate encounters with a specific dream character this week.

Hi, Josh. Creating a dream character on the spot may be easier if you enjoy science fiction or fantasy in your waking life, as these things tend to deal with things like states of consciousness and magical manipulation. My favorites are Star Trek and The Twilight Zone. In fact, I created a dream lover, using almost word for word the character creation process used by a playwright who could make his characters come alive simply by describing them verbally on a tape. Similarly, he could destroy the character simply by throwing the tape into the fire. I don't recall the title of the particular Twilight Zone episode I'm referring to, but it's one of my favorites. In my dream, I became lucid, and decided I wanted an extra character, who was not then in the dream. In fact, when I said this character existed, the others questioned my sanity in quite a realistic fashion. Realizing the enormity of my claim, and wondering if they were right, I really was insane, I almost lost lucidity. Nevertheless, I said I'd prove it to them, and began to intone in the fashion of the Twilight Zone playwright: "His name is Kealoha. He is Hawaiian, and the identical twin brother of Kalani, (who was in the dream, and driving the car I was in with the other dream characters) "He is tall and dark, very musical, and has a lovely deep voice. Just now, he is on the way to the Kahului airport." As I continue to describe this person, the car comes to a screeching halt, and one of the other dream characters, exclaims "Holy sh.." As in my waking life, so in my dreams: I am blind, but the people around me can see. This dream character was sighted, and her exclamation was followed by a description of the guy who seemed to materialize in front of us on the road. Meanwhile, Kalani, the Hawaiian driver, was speaking in Hawaiian Pidgin to the identical twin brother who, a moment previously, had not existed. The other characters stopped questioning my sanity in short order, and of course, you know, the lovely and gorgeous and multitalented Kealoha and I became lovers. This was one of my most romantic LD sex dreams, and if I may coin a phrase, "my lucidest lucid dream." In other dreams less romantic and more hedonistic, his equally gorgeous twin brother Kalani got into the erotic fracas, and a grand time was had by all. As a matter of fact, I ended up in a polygamous marriage to both of them, so the same dream satisfied both my romantic schoolgirl in love and my hedonistic personas. Both Madonna and Whore parts of my personality were satisfied by this dream. Anyway, sorry for the digression ... But as you can see, dream character creation, and indeed lucidity itself, can be enhanced by a love of sci-fi and fantasy. Just an aside, another one--before I found the LI, I became lucid by observing that a radio turned off still played, and quoted Mister Spock verbatim by saying: "Physical laws cannot simply be ignored. Where the laws do not operate, there can be no reality. All of this is unreal." I then proceeded to change a nightmare situation into one more pleasant, again, involving dream romance.

An interesting topic. Thea, I am truly inspired by your dream character creations. Reminds me of that line from a song, "looking for love in all the wrong places" except the line becomes "looking for love in all the best places." I admire your freedom of expression, your boldness, and your willingness to share.

As for Paul's question, "can anyone relate?" my guess is that most of us can. We come to awareness in dreams of parts of us that we like to hide. We get to ask, Is it the part that we want to change, or our lack of acceptance of the part?

Josh, I like the way you use LDing to enhance your life (although I would argue about the line, "finding dates is not really an option for me," but I digress.) I am curious however by what you mean when you say 'specific dream character'? Are you refering to a made-up character that re-appears, thus having a certain stable context? Or do you mean calling forth the image of someone you know in your everyday life? Also, can you further explain what you mean when you say, "introducing a specific dream character requires a big change in the dream flow. It took me many LDs to figure out how to overcome that challenge. So far the effort has been paying off." How did you overcome that challenge?

I wonder if those reading this thread have also read the thread under "Open Conversation" ..."Sexuality, and experiences in Lucid Dreams". In that thread there was some discussion about sex and personal ethics, what is OK, what is not.

Finally, I have some free time to respond! I've been experiencing crunch time at work so I had no time except for work and sleep. Obviously, the post I put up was very generalized and lacking details. The things I've learned and the personal experiments I've done on myself to explore and work with Lucid Dreaming would take me pages to explain. But I'll add in as much as I can depending on what comes up on the posts.

The dream character I mentioned is a made up character I came up with, who's look and style evolved with my computer animation art and experiments. She's a combination of the bits of things here and there of what I find the most interesting and attractive. Her look is inspired from other people's art as well as from my own imagination. At least at the time when I built her. (It took me around 4 months of what ever time I could scrap up just for the 1st renderable/animatable version.) I just find interacting with her more fulfilling then with just some random female character.

I think I may have mentioned the subject of dream flow in another post. But what I found from the many LDs I have is that dream characters tend to be part of the dream flow. I find it very difficult to change the subject or theme of the dream from what ever it happens to be, lets say, you're at a mall full of people, or wondering around a suburb late at night with no one around, to a setting where you can be alone with specific dream character. In the rare occasions that I have been able to manifest my favorite dream character in a very unrelated dream flow, she tends to disappear of fade out. There has been techniques I would discover that would work for a few LDs, but would stop working afterwards. On another post, I mentioned a pre-dream phase I called The Void. I tend to go though it a lot going into WILDs, which is my main LD induction technique. I found that it's possible to predetermine the dream flow in this state. I had the most realistic, long lasting, interactive experiences with my favorite dream character as a result of making use of this void phase. So far this technique worked for me in the last 3 weeks.

I'd like to go into how using media helps with dream character creation, which Thea brought up. But my time ran out.

Cheers,

Josh,

It sounds like you have put a lot of time and diligence into creating a specific dream character. Have you used your computer animation art and experiments to create the setting in which you would like to interact with your character?

I recommend buying a body-length pillow! They're sexy!

LOL

In response to PaulSirottas comments concerning guilt over lucid dream content, It's my opinion that you should never feel guilty about anything that happens in a dream, lucid or non-lucid. We are all yin and yang after all and everyone has a darker side to them whether they care to admit it or not. It's part of being human. Dreams can give us the opportunity to explore every aspect of our inner selves, and to come to terms with and learn to understand both the pleasant and less pleasant aspects of our personalities. I don't believe that acting out a kinky fantasy or robbing a bank in a lucid dream will ever change your waking self. On the contrary I believe dreams act as a harmless release for these less attractive aspects of our psyche, and maybe there would be less real pain and suffering in the world if everyone had the ability to lucid dream and could work through these things in the harmless world of dreams.

Hello All, Let's remember that we are talking about lucid dreaming. Since we are conscious in LD's we have the power to guide our actions. With that in mind, there is no reason to choose actions that will spawn guilt. If you want to fight, turn the situation into a Karate match, for example, rather than an attack on innocence, if you want to have sex, chose your real life partner, etc. To make a long story short, your dream experiences are real experiences to your mind and can create real emotions so chose your actions to be in alignment with your values and you will have no problems.

Thomas

Thomas:

Nicely said!

Since lucidity at its best is full conscious awareness of "Self" in a dream environment, perhaps it would be best to morally behave as you would in waking life.

After all, being "aware" of your actions, even if no one else is, allows you to understand any moral betrayals you might make, and potentially feel truly guilty for your actions. The guilt would stem not from actually hurting people you love (or don't much like, if you choose violence against someone) -- they're obviously not real and will never know what you did. It would instead emerge from your realization that you were in charge of a situation in its entirety, and consciously chose to behave badly, to spin your moral compass, just because you could. Since LD's can tend to linger as "real" memories of conscious moments, you run the risk of the bad thing you did while dreaming grinding against all of your remembered efforts to live a good life.

Best of Dreams,

Peter

Howdy all,

Some off the cuff thoughts on the subject.

In real life when someone does something we'd consider immoral, it is normally some offense against someone, so we focus on the damage that is done to the victim. Since we usually despise the actions of the person who has committed the offense, we don't normally think of, or really care about the damage this person has done to themself in carrying out an immoral act. I'm not talking in terms of God or religion, but emotional, or psychological damage that that a person does to themself. This must be part of what spiritual or psychological counselors need to work on when helping a person who has committed waking life offenses.

Lucid dreams create a situation where you cannot harm anyone, but can we do damage to ourselves? Ultimately, I believe the answer is no; its possible for actions in lucid dreams to have no negative effect on us at all, however we do not have any kind of cultural support system that deals with this. Its likely that for many people their waking life guilt, or dissociation, or whatever, would kick in and do the damage that would normally be done in waking life.

I guess it would be a matter of whether you have a mature enough philosophy of lucid dreaming experience to protect you from causing yourself any damage by lucid dream offenses.

Gordon:

What about when a lucid dreamer does something that they consider immoral? Let's take it to the extreme - let's say an LD'er murders someone -- and I don't mean poofing an unwanted dream character into oblivion, but actually engaging, by choice, in the visceral act of snuffing the life from someone that they know? That can feel very real during a lucid dream, and can linger as a "real" memory in the waking dreamer's mind.

Or, to stay on subject, what if a dreamer lucidly engaged in sex, just as visceral as the above murder, with a partner who in real life would be expressely forbidden by their own morality (not the rules of law or marriage, for instance, but by their own rules about what is right)?

Since lucid dreaming is all about consciousness, and a conscious experience is a conscious experience whether we're awake or asleep (providing we're LD'ing), how mature does our philosophy need to be for us to dismiss as "not real" conscious decisions to betray our own personal codes of ethics?

Peter

I'd say that if a person feels guilty about dream sex or it follows them around during the day (in the form of guilt), that person is carrying over waking-life reality into a realm that it simply don't apply. What this person would need to ask themself is why do I want to do that? If they find it offensive, it's their own desires that they need to question. Is this the person I want to be?

Is playing Tomb Raider immoral? How is that different from a lucid dream other than the level of detail and control? You are willfully killing imaginary characters. How about the choice of watching a movie with sex in it? Can you say lucid dream sex is immoral without concluding that these are also immoral?

If the issue is that it is so close to reality that it could be dangerous, then it comes down to philosophical maturity, because you haven't thought through this aspect of the difference between waking life and dreams.

If you can separate them in your mind from waking life, a mature philosphy of lucid dreaming experience, then I wouldn't call them ethically wrong.

Like I said above, what you need to be asking is why you want to do it, which I don't consider a moral issue, but a personal growth or identity issue.

What is the function of our personal code of ethics and why should it apply to our dream life any more than the rules of using a toilet in zero gravity apply to our earthbound restrooms? : )

Gordon:

I'm not suggesting, or trying to decide if something is immoral ' I'm not even interested in labeling what's moral or not moral ' that's not my place, and doesn't even belong in this discussion.

What I am saying is that if a dreamer's actions during a lucid dream willfully conflict with his own sense of what is right (not an establishment sense, or textbook sense, or religious sense, or whatever other ethical label you'd like to attach, but his OWN personal feelings about his behavior), he must consciously decide before he takes that action to ignore what he believes is right. He is basically betraying his own sense of right and wrong just to have the experience he has chosen.

Though there are certainly plenty of people who will not play Tomb Raider or watch hard core pornography because it betrays that very sense, what we are discussing is not like that for one glaring reason: Tomb Raider and pornography are experiences presented to us by others ' they are not our misdeed, so we can become a voyeur, or ersatz murderer for a few minutes without guilt. Also, yes, technology has not yet progressed to the point where video games or pornography begin to be as real and experience as a lucid dream; when it does, that argument will change.

This has nothing, nothing, nothing to do with intellectually deciding whether something is ethically wrong during a dream ' it has to do with deciding to participate in an action that you KNOW is wrong, in the deepest part of your being. If a "mature" philosophy involves separating yourself from who you are, then maturity might cause more damage than doing bad things in your dreams.

Unlike the zero-gravity toilet/restroom comparison, our personal code of ethics is not a rulebook we can discard simply because our consciousness is in a place where nobody can see us. Our personal code of ethics isn't a rulebook at all ' it IS us, and how we see ourselves. Intellectually discarding the basis for how you choose to behave simply because you can might not be sourced in philosophical maturity, but rather in a willingness to abandon that which you otherwise would deem as your self. Perhaps the real philosophical maturity is to perform personally reprehensible acts in dreams, and then be able to remember them constructively (without guilt) in the waking world. Or, more simply stated, perhaps the real philosophical maturity is to be able to discuss anything you dreamed with your spouse in the morning.

I hope I was more clear this time.

The Best of Dreams,

Peter

Interesting. I'd disagree with you though on the point that "our personal code of ethics is not a rulebook we can discard simply because our consciousness is in a place where nobody can see us." I'd take the opposite line here and say that if we are intelligent and well-balanced individuals, then the first thing we should do in our dreams is throw away the rulebook. If we carry our rulebook with us into our dreams we are not truly dreaming, we may as well be awake. For me at least, dreams are a place of exploration and somewhere I can get to know the real me. Let me put it this way. As human animals we all harbour ideas and desires which are not compatible with our real waking lives, or would mess things up big time. As an example I may harbour a secret desire to sleep with my partners sister. I bury that desire in my waking life, but in my dreams I believe that I am free to explore this at will. At the end of the day this is a dream, it's not reality and as long as you are of sound mind and can tell the difference between dreams and reality, then these dreams are your own private workspace, and you are not accountable to anyone for them, you are certainly not being unfaithfull. It's much like your waking sexual fantasies. I think it's a rare person that can claim they only fantasise about their own partner sexually, and would feel obliged to share with their partner their most private sexual fantasies. Your dreams are your own, they are a moral testing ground which can help you work out problems in ways you never could in you waking life. Everyone has and should have their own personal area. It's healthy, but the rulebook in dreams isn't, in my opinion.

Nick:

I reread my post and confirmed that I never said anything about bringing a "rulebook" into your lucid dreams with you. Indeed, I believe I said the exact opposite - your personal code of ethics is NOT a rulebook, but an integral part of you. Perhaps I shouldn't have used the word, "code?"

This is not a matter of semantics, either. I completely agree that one shouldn't have lucid dreams be based on "official," or someone else's codes of behavior. That would be absurd, and may totally defeat the purpose. What I was saying (and I promise to only say it one more time!) was that when an individual does something that he feels, in the depths of his soul, to be wrong, his self-appointed misadventure might not have a positive impact on his psyche.

As far as exploration goes, I completely agree -- one should try everything he desires, create vistas and situations that push his imagination to the very edge, and place himself in scenarios that might help define him as a person. That's one of the most important aspects of lucid dreaming.

I just wanted to point out that if a lucid dreamer does things while lucid that he feels without prompting or outside instruction are bad, then he may have to deal with his actions later, even if no one was hurt and nobody knows what he did.

And you're right - in a dream, you have no chance (as far as we know) of hurting anyone. Except yourself. And even if you're immune to damage, is inspecting the basal desires of a "human animal" that we've spent 3 million years learning to rise above really necessary?

Immaturely,

Peter

P.S. This of reminds me of that Zen koan: "If a tree falls in the forest and no one is there to hear it, does it make a sound?' Cheesy, I know, but it seems appropriate.

Peter,

I didn't mean to challenge your belief system and would have chosen my words more carefully if I thought it could have happened.

I see identity, codes of ethics, and most importantly who I am as constantly evolving and adapting to new conditions and my emerging reality that I find as I continue to learn. It was my own narrow-mindedness that caused me to fail to see that other people may put different values on these things and I spoke as if what I was saying was an objective truth, something that I do not believe any of us have access to.

I think both our posts stand as our perspectives on this. I'll try and gracefully remove myself from the topic before any more of my diplomatic immaturity rears its head. : )

Thanks Gordon!

No need to remove yourself from the thread, of course; expressing, and arguing for, different points of view is the lifeblood of this forum.

Best of Dreams,

Peter

Dear Peter, Gordon, Nick, Thomas, et al,

To add an amusing aside to this worthy discussion, have you ever watched the reaction of someone who's just been told they were in someone's dream? "Gosh! I hope I didn't do anything to embarrass myself!", is what I've heard a few folks say. ;)

Peter, this would be a great topic to address during the upcoming retreat (not a new subject, but certainly timely since it's come up here and now). We can ask one of our scholarship recipients to write up the discussion and present it here on the Forum when we return. What do you think?

Okay, I'm off to pack my pineapple shirt.... Sweet dreams and warm aloha to all! Keelin

Keelin:

That's an excellent idea! A roomful of opinions about this subject would be a blast. We should do it.

Peter

Dear Peter,

Well, actually, for a moment, I thought this was YOUR idea, but then it was in My dream in which you suggested it, so I guess you can't really take the credit -- unless, of course, you're one of those who feels responsible for what you do in other people's dreams. ;)

See you soon in the waking dream of Kalani! Keelin

I'm having a significant problem with sex in lucid dreams: every time I try it (which is quite often), I wake up almost immediately! Without fail, within seconds of initiating any sexual contact, I feel the dream begin to fade and, despite my efforts at staying asleep through spinning, I awaken (or falsely awaken). The strange thing is is that when I restrain my sexual impulses, I can usually stay in the dream for quite awhile, and when a sexless dream starts to fade, spinning usually works. I've made sure not to close my eyes or lie down when I get close to a dream-woman, but this hasn't helped. This is baffling to me and, as you might imagine, extremely frustrating. Any suggestions as to why this might be happening and how I might overcome it?

Many thanks,

Damian

Dream Viagra? (just kidding)

Dream Tantra? (more serious; gotsta practice control)

Dominick:

Thanks for your semi-serious reply. But what exactly do you mean by "control"?

Damian

Damian,

Control is an issue, because the sexual sensations will tend to make your physical body too excited, and it will wake you up. Natural inclination is to seek out the very intense sensation; I find that I have to distance myself from it just a bit, keep it from being too intense, and it lets me stay in the dream. It's tough to ride the fine line between relaxing so much that you lose lucidity, and becoming so aroused that you wake.

I also have a problem with sexual lucid dreams, because I tend to close my eyes in the dream while enjoying the sensation - it invariably leads to losing track of the dream, and I either wake up, or find myself in that half-asleep limbo.

Damian, just a word, here. Save your fun and games for later in the dream, if you can. It sounds like you have the necessary control of your dreams. I try to always have a few tasks in mind for my next LD. After I've accomplished them I let my dream go where it will. That way, even if I do awaken, I still feel like I have had a useful experience.

As far as waking during dream sex...BUMMER!

Paul and Michael,

Thanks for the suggestions. I often get so excited about the sexual possibilities of lucid dreaming that I don't take the time to explore other possibilities. And, as you say, Michael, it may be excessive excitement that stops me from bringing any of these possibilities to fruition.

Damian

Damian, believe it or not dream sex does get a little old after awhile, and one begins to wonder if there isn't something a bit more worthwhile to spend those precious LD times doing. It's the "Been there, done that" syndrome. You want to experience something else, something that isn't simply a dream mimicking waking life in some way.

Lately I have been posing some of life's great questions to the dream gods just to see what answers come back (from my own consciousness, of course--or is it?) Last dream I asked to be shown "the one behind the many". I was immediately confronted by two dream characters who handed me a glowing, spinning yellow sphere. It took on the shape of a big yellow tomato, which I began to eat. It was truly the most delicious thing I had ever tasted, and the more I chewed it, the sweeter it became. Nor was the tomato diminished at all. I was consumed by the tomato!!

Pretty wierd, huh? Food for thought!

Paul

I had to deal with Damian's issue. I actually found a solution that had cut the awakenings from sexual encounters by half. I found that, as a male, If I'm aroused in my dreams, I'm aroused physically. The key is to make sure nothing disrupts your physical arousal (sheets, clothing, ex). Since I confronted the issue with this approach, around half of my lucid dreams that has sexual encounters, played out without the dream fading out. In some cases (rare), I get a couple of encounters in one long dream.

Hi, guys. I think I have an advantage here as a person who was born blind, as my dreams do not contain sight in any form, as I have never had it. Therefore, I can enjoy as much dream sex (and romance), as I want. I've also been reading the posts re moral actions and personal codes. I had an afternoon nap today. I usually become lucid within the dream. At some moment or other, I hear myself saying, "This is a dream." Today I said that in a roomful of people who were all chatting together. I said, "This is a dream. All of you are dream characters. Even I'm only a dream character." "Hmm. What can I be, that I would never in a million years, be in the real world? I know. I want to be a prostitute." Bam. I'm out in the middle of the road, and a car pulls up. I start chatting up the driver, and we strike a bargain. Some lovin' for a beer. I hop into the back seat and we drive off. I remember some music playing in the car, but it is not clear now what it was. As we talked, it became clear the driver was too drunk to do much but talk. In addition, he wasn't going to take me into the pub for that drink. He was hoping I'd go for a beer out of the 6-pack in his car. So I say, "Look, no money has changed hands, so let's put a raincheck on this. Thanks for the ride>" I get out of the car, and walk into the pub before which we have stopped. I hear loud music, and am aware of the pub floor under my feet, all the sensory sensations I would be aware of in waking life. I'm looking for more viable prospects--when someone I know, a woman who was with me at Guide Dogs for the Blind, came up and asked, "Thea, you're not back into this, are you?" Apparently, I'd lost some of my lucidity, because this character was referring to my actions as though they were real, and I'd done this before. Of course, she's chastising hell out of me. My memory of events is not as clear here, but I do remember walking out of the pub. No luck there. Time seems to have passed then, and I've gained some notoriety as not just your average woman of the streets. Hmm. Whatever happened to that first customer? LOL Seems I've turned sex into an art form, added a touch of affection and TLC to it, and was labelled "the romantic prostitute." (Talk about a contradiction in terms, but it worked) Anyway, I'm at Guide Dogs for the Blind, walking down the corridor in the dormitory, which, in real life, was co-ed. It is so in the dream as well. Knowing that I might be dismissed from the school for plying my trade, I walk into one of the student's rooms. In reality, this was a person I thought very nice, with an attractive voice. At least, I do get to actually enjoy the action, but as I said, not the normal wham-bam kind of thing. I know just how and where to touch him to make him feel good. I massage him, kiss him, and he is ready for the rest. It was very nice. Later, at the dinner table, I feel poised and very sure of my ability to seduce and flirt. There are several men at the table, and I'm the only woman. While my guide dog lays at my feet under the table, I'm garnering male admiration, no trouble. When there are just the two of us at the table, D. says, "You may hear rumors that G. (the guy I was with), has decided he loves you. I think he wants you to quit working." I walk out the door of the school, and into the street. Here comes a prospect who doesn't want "all the trimmings, just the sex, please." We get into his car, and I'm undressing when he says, "Where'd you get that scar?" "Oh, that? Knife wound from a weirdo I met." Speaking of rules during dreams, I tell this new fellow about mine. "Before we get started, I don't do anything involving urine, feces, or sadomasochism. If it doesn't feel good, I don't do it." This was fine with him. I don't remember any significant actions beyond that. Back at Guide Dogs, I'm in the corridor, and I know if I turn right and wlk down that way, I'm heading toward the waking world. I keep saying, "I have to go back", but hesitate, just in case, some dream character wants to avail himself of my services. Reluctantly, I walk down the hall toward the waking world,, poof! find myself in some kind of contraption going backwards, out of the dream world, back into the waking one. My personal codes are in reality Christian in nature, and as I said, I would never do this in a million years. But I wondered why I'd choose to be a prostitute in the dream world. Then, as I wrote this down, it occurred to me. My own words in the dream provide the answer. "You are all dream characters, and so am I." I knew myself to be, not Thea Ramsay of the waking world making a choice contrary to her own code, but Thea Ramsay dressing up in a costume and played on a stage that was, admittedly, quite virtual, but a stage nonetheless. Time passed as it does in a movie. Also, my lucidity has a habit of fading in and out, as a camera does. When I made the choice to live as a prostitute in this dream, I was very lucid and aware of the unreality of the world, and even of myself. When I stood in the corridor on the way back to the waking world, I was again lucid. But when I was "in character", I forgot that this was a dream. Therefore, when I awoke, I had the fun of choosing, courtesy of lucidity, something totally outrageous, and the nonguilt of not being conscious of my choices at each moment of the dream. Once I put on the costume as it were, I was in character, and that was that. When I signalled myself that it was just about time to wake up, I was out of costume, out of character--and very lucid. Perhaps my affinity with stage and movies insulates me from a guilt I might feel were I lucid during each moment of the dream. Anyway, it was a fun dream, and while I'm trying to examine the psychology of my choosing to explore prostitution, I do not feel any guilt about it. Only a detached bewilderment. What in the world made me choose that? Sorry for the long post. Guess I'm still thinking aloud here. Thea

Thea, wow! That was great! I never have dream sex stories. Just man style--quick and painless.

Paul

Paul, here's to your enjoying a dream sex story. Thea

Thea, I am seriously going to try to have more romantic and meaningful dream sex in the future.

Paul

Maybe this is a woman thing, I don't know. But I find that when there's a touch of romance in the dream, I awake feeling kind of happy. And trust me, I've had some pretty exotic dreams, lucid and non. Besides the dream I described yesterday, I've found myself in the world of dreams falling in love with a woman, married to both a man and a woman, (my favorite singer and the lady who put together a website dedicated to him), and cohabiting with two men. Beside these dreams, I suppose that dreaming of being my favorite singer's mistress or wife sounds pretty tame. Did that, too. My mother once said she could find the humor in anything. I seem to find romance in everything. The scenarios I've just described in my dreams are usually stuff from which pornos are made, yet my dreaming mind always overshadows everything with romance and love. The one dream I had which was nonlucid and featured meaningless and degrading sex, featured me in a mental hospital where I hooked up with a sex addict who, after it was all over, proceeded to pee on me. I awoke feeling dirty. I felt kind of yucky all day, in fact, whereas the romantic dreams, however bizarre they might be in terms of the setup, always leave me smiling. The dream about my marriage to both Maurice and Sheila kept me smiling for weeks, as I recall, because there was so much love in it. I was so in love with him, and with her, and each of them with me. Bizarre, huh? Hehehehe. Here's to love, in whatever form you dream it.--Thea

Thea, usually I don't even stop to talk. I'm a dream rapist, emphasis on the word DREAM. I used to worry a lot about whether this meant I was a closet sex offender, but since I have no such impulses or fantasies awake I think not. However, I am very big on instant gratification! Like I said, I'm going to work on this in dreamtime.

Paul

This may be a woman thing, but I find talk of some sort, be it sweet or naughty, and foreplay and all that very important to my enjoyment of sex, dream or otherwise. Here's hoping it enriches yours too--dream and otherwise. Thea

Thea,

I don't ever plan sexual dream experiences, nor consciously desire them, they just seem to materialize while I'm in the midst of more spiritual pursuits. I really need to learn not to give in to the sudden appearance of dream partners. I really don't intend to become distracted, but (a man thing?) it's difficult to look the other way. I don't really value dream sex as an experience any more, a case of "Been there, done that". That's probably the main reason I keep it superficial, don't invest any valuable LD time, short as it is.

Paul

Hi, Paul. Perhaps this is a woman thing, I don't know. I see sex, dream or otherwise, as a meaningful experience and don't believe it has to be necessarily void of spiritual overtones, particularly when love, dream or otherwise, is a factor.

Thea, I didn't mean to imply that sexuality isn't spiritual or meaningful for me. In dreams, however, I am actually both (or all) of the consenting adults involved, right? I'm having sex with myself. So how spiritual or meaningful can it really be under those conditions? I'm not really connecting with another soul of the opposite energy polarity.

Paul

Sure you are, Paul. LOL You're connecting with an opposite part of yourself. Thea, just playing with your head, but maybe there's a kernel of truth there. Hmm. Not sure if I want to explore this somewhat Tantric thread, as my dreams have featured me in some bizarre love matches. Hehehehe. On the other hand, it's amusing to contemplate. Just how many parts of oneself can one have sex with at once? Right. Better have my shrink evaluate my current med. Hahahaha.

Thea, this is a dream sex thread, so anything goes. Talking about sex is the next best thing to having it, don't you know. So, is dream sex really just another form of autoeroticism? (Which doesn't mean having sex with your car, does it?)

Paul

Hi, Paul. The only way autoeroticism means sex with your car is if you put a space after auto. Hehehehe. That shrink o'mine needs to check my meds. Definitely.

Here, have one of my Levitra...

Paul